Tithing

Discuss topics, questions, answers, etc. here!

Moderator: samw3

Is tithing biblically required for christians today?

Yes
0
No votes
No, but it is good to tithe anyways.
3
100%
No, and it's not good anymore. Christians should only give what they want to when they want to, or when they see a legitimate need.
0
No votes
No, there is no reason to tithe or give ever.
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 3
b-o
Posts: 353
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2009 8:29 pm

Tithing

Postby b-o » Mon Feb 11, 2013 2:02 pm

I've been looking at the concept of tithing a bit lately, and found the case against christian tithing interesting, despite it being a view rarely discussed or engaged. Tithing is not the same thing as giving. While tithing is viewed as compulsory/required, giving isn't viewed as obligatory.

There is a slideshow with an overview of some of the issues here: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid= ... 8b82880ef6

Free books and stuff on the subject can be found here http://www.tithingdebate.com/

What do you think? If you think it's biblical for Christians to tithe, how did you come to that conclusion, and where do you get the criteria for what and when to tithe or give, and who to give it to?
User avatar
bugala
Posts: 1279
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 11:43 pm
Location: Finland
Contact:

Re: Tithing

Postby bugala » Tue Feb 12, 2013 3:35 am

[kjv]Mal 3:8[/kjv] "...Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes AND OFFERINGS."

[kjv]Mal 3:10[/kjv] "Bring ye ALL the tithes..."

I believe this "All the tithes" refers to including the offerings as well, not just tithes.


In this video: http://www.awmi.net/financial_seminar Paul Milligan points out that someone had calculated that including all the offerings, the real percentage you should be giving would be something like 1/3rd of your income (he had not checked if it was true or not) but point is that many use this part to justify tithes, yet they completely ignore the offerings part.

That 10 part seminar is best video serie about tithings or giving that i have ever saw. Unfortuantely he uses 10 hours to something he could have said in say 3 hours very well already.


I believe what he teaches in that Video.

To put it extremely short, is that you need to follow Holy Ghosts advice on where to give and how much. And by the way, if Holy Ghost instructs you to give more money than you have, then you havent followed his Financial plan for your life.



To squeeze my thoughts another way about the subject, I am going to use word "Revelation" very loosely without the actual meaning of it.

I think first revelation people get about giving is the tithes.

Second revelation they get is to give until your back is broke (and it many times happens so).

Then the third revelation, the (I believe) right one, is the stewardship principle.

Idea is that you are Gods Stewardship and hence you need to manage your finances accordingly. This stewardship principle is what Paul Milligan is talking about in that long serie of videos.
b-o
Posts: 353
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2009 8:29 pm

Re: Tithing

Postby b-o » Tue Feb 12, 2013 12:26 pm

I don't think there is any question that it is proper to give to good causes, whether its supporting a ministry, a church, or helping the needy, etc. I'm not really asking about free will offerings, or the proper amount of voluntary giving as much as I am asking about tithes, such as seem to be common and mandatory in European state churches, some of which will revoke your right to marriage in their church, baptism of your children in their church, or religious burial if you don't give them 10%.
bugala wrote:[kjv]Mal 3:8[/kjv] "...Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes AND OFFERINGS."
[kjv]Mal 3:10[/kjv] "Bring ye ALL the tithes..."
I believe this "All the tithes" refers to including the offerings as well, not just tithes.
The word 'all' there is the Hebrew word for 'whole', and the same Hebrew word is translated as 'whole' in verse 9. Some Commentaries seem to look at it as meaning 'whole' in verse 10 as well, and some versions translate it that way:
(ESV) Bring the full tithe, (Darby) Bring the whole tithe, (GEB) Bringet den ganzen Zehnten /Bring the whole tenth/ All of the German versions seem to have it similarly with slight word order difference though. But keep reading the verse and notice that the purpose of the stuff brought to the 'storehouse' is for there to be meat in God's house. This was used for food by the priests. It seems to match the tithe of tithes mentioned in [nasb]Nehemiah 10:38[/nasb]. The location those tithes were taken to in Malachi is also notable, and might help demonstrate the context. [nasb]Nehemiah 10:37-38[/nasb] seems to show that the third year tithe which went to the Levites who couldn't own property was then tithed from the Levites, and what all of the Levites tithed is what went into the storehouse or treasure house(which are the same Hebrew words). 10% of 10% would be 1% of the 3rd year tithe, so about 0.33% of three years profit went to the storehouse as a tithe in that situation to provide food and stuff for the priests. The 1st, 2nd, 4th and 5th year tithes which were used for feasting don't seem to involve the storehouse when considering what [nasb]Deuteronomy 14:24-26[/nasb] says to do with them; They sold the increase if they couldn't transport it, then they'd use up that money by buying whatever they wanted, throwing a feast and inviting their family, the poor and others, celebrating how God had provided for them. Are there any tithing churches today who do that?
bugala wrote:To put it extremely short, is that you need to follow Holy Ghosts advice on where to give and how much. And by the way, if Holy Ghost instructs you to give more money than you have, then you havent followed his Financial plan for your life.
What do you mean by 'holy spirits advice' ? I visited one church where they said that the way that you can know what God would have you give is by thinking of a number, doubling it, and then adding a little bit more, which seems sort of arbitrary and unbiblical to me.
bugala wrote: In this video: http://www.awmi.net/financial_seminar Paul Milligan points out
One thing that stuck out to me in the first video was that he said that if you are a christian with cancer, that you are already healed. I don't see how there is any support for that when the bible teaches people with sickness to deal with it, like having medicine( i.e. a little wine for your stomachs sake, etc.) , or having elders pray for you. But I guess that is a subject for another thread.
User avatar
CPUFreak91
Posts: 990
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 1:02 pm
Location: San Antonio, TX

Re: Tithing

Postby CPUFreak91 » Wed Feb 13, 2013 9:00 am

I think the concept of tithing is not as important in the Christian church as it was for the Israelite community. It's definitely good for Christians to give to meet the needs of others (James 1:17), and tithing will only make that easier. However, if a large community can cover a need, not many people are going to have to give/tithe 10% of their wealth. Conversely, if the community is small, and the need is great, you'll find Christians giving above the 10% some times.

Paul himself encouraged the church in Corinth to take up collections on his behalf, so that he didn't have to waste his time fundraising for the famine in Israel (emphasis added):
Now, in regard to the collection being made for God's people: you are to do the same as I directed the congregations in Galatia to do. Every week, on the Sabbath, each of you should set some money aside, according to his resources, and save it up; so that when I come I won't have to do fundraising. (1 Cor. 16:1-2)
He didn't set a specific amount, like what is commanded in the Old Testament (tithe equalling 1/10th). Keep in mind that the Israelite community had a passel of Levites (priests, temple helpers, etc) to support, who did not work the land, or do business like the rest of the people, whereas the church did not have a specific group of people that they had to support 24/7.
59 6f 75 20 72 65 61 64 20 6d 79 20 73 69 67 6e 61 74 75 72 65 2e 20 47 6f 6f 64 20 66 6f 72 20 79 6f 75 21

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests

cron